Excerpts of Talks between Leading Comrades and Foreign Guests (No. 13)

Secret

No. 000026
 

Excerpts of Talks between Leading Comrades and Foreign Guests (No. 13)

December 10, 1982
 

Contents
General Secretary Hu Yaobang's Meeting with Vice President Khieu Samphan of Democratic Kampuchea

General Secretary Hu Yaobang's Meeting with Vice President Khieu Samphan of Democratic Kampuchea

On November 11, Comrade Hu Yaobang met with Khieu Samphan, Vice President of Democratic Kampuchea. They discussed the situation of the struggle in Cambodia, the united front, the war of aggression, the law of the war against aggression, and other issues. 

Regarding the situation of struggle in Cambodia, Comrade Hu said that the situation of struggle in Cambodia is getting better and better.  Currently the struggle is in the fifth dry season, and if we can still hold off the Vietnamese advance this time, the situation will change significantly. Regarding the united front, Comrade Yaobang said that you should form a united government and the leaders of the three factions should attend the UNGA meeting together. This is a new breakthrough in the united front that you have made. He said that your domestic united front work was very important. Only when the domestic united front work was successfully accomplished could you win wide sympathy and support from the international community.  This made it possible to form a united front with ASEAN and the Southeast Asian countries against Vietnamese regional hegemony. Without that domestic united front, there can be no international united front against the Vietnamese hegemony, and without the international united front, it will be impossible to change the balance of power between you and Vietnam otherwise the basic situation of a strong enemy facing weak opponents would continue.

Therefore the domestic and international united fronts are both very important.  The two are directly related and complementary.  Comrade Hu Yaobang also said that in the past, we engaged in united front work just as you are doing now.  The methods were similar, that is, you need to unite and struggle at the same time.  When you are united, do not forget the struggle.  When you struggle, be careful not to destroy unity.  Chairman Mao summed it up as reasonable, looking to advantage and well-calibrated. 

Comrade Hu Yaobang also talked about his views on contemporary wars of aggression and wars against aggression. He said that in contemporary historical conditions, in wars of aggression and wars of resistance to invasion, even the strongest modern armed forces of the aggressor country may be defeated or even destroyed by the weaker regular armies of the invaded country because they are never able to destroy the patriotic guerrilla armed forces of the invaded country. This is an important law of contemporary history.  Comrade Hu Yaobang said that in April 1980, less than four months after the Soviet Union invaded Afghanistan, I told Comrade Enrico Berlinguer that the Soviet Union had already become bogged down in Afghanistan and if it continues its aggressive policy, it will not be able to extricate itself for at least five years.

As for Cambodia, I said at that time that the situation of the Cambodian people's struggle was getting better and better, that the most difficult moment had passed. The struggle against the Vietnamese invading army was now on track now that the resistance is more confident and better organized. The more than two years that have passed since have shown that my view was correct. In my opinion, the invasion of Afghanistan by the Soviet authorities and the invasion of Cambodia by the Vietnamese authorities may be different but they have one fundamental point in common. The invaders overestimated their own power and underestimated the people and the patriotic guerrilla forces. They think they can wipe out the people's guerrilla forces in one fell swoop by relying on their strong military power.  But they forget the truth that Lenin repeatedly stated: the just war of the people cannot be extinguished by any force.

To illustrate this truth, I would like to list ten major historical events since the Second World War:

1. Hitler used the blitzkrieg to destroy millions of French regular troops, the most powerful in Europe at that time, but they were helpless against the French partisan forces. Towards the end of the Second World War, the French partisan forces had grown to half a million men.

2. In 1944, Mussolini's life was saved by the German Fascist army, but the Italian people's armed forces were not only not destroyed, but they once again arrested Mussolini and sent him to the gallows and in addition destroyed the invading German army.

3. The regular army of King Peter II of Yugoslavia was destroyed by the German fascists but the people's armed forces led by Comrade Tito persisted in the war for four years and finally liberated the country.

4. Ethiopia was occupied by Italy in 1936 and became part of the Italian East African Empire, but the Ethiopian people persisted in guerrilla warfare, and finally drove out the Italian fascist army.

5. We in China persevered for eight years in the struggle against Japanese imperialism. At that time, we had the Japanese imperialists in front of us and Chiang Kai-shek's Kuomintang behind us, ambushing us. The people's guerrilla forces led by the Communist Party of China persisted in penetrating and going behind the enemy lines, consolidating and developing revolutionary bases, and developing from a few tens of thousands of people to a great force of 100 million people in the liberated areas, one million troops and two million militiamen. In the end, they cooperated with the Soviet and American allied forces and defeated the Japanese imperialists.

6. The armed forces of the Indonesian people waged a guerrilla war against the Japanese invaders during the Japanese invasion, and then against the Dutch colonial forces, and finally won the independence of their country.

7. When the Japanese invasion forces invaded the Philippines, Burma and Malaysia, the people of these three countries persevered and developed their people's guerrilla warfare and were never destroyed by the Japanese, and finally, with the assistance of the Allies, they gained the independence of their respective countries.

8. France, which poured 800,000 troops into Algeria, including most of the French army, 90 percent of its navy, and 60 percent of its air force.  They slaughtered millions of Algerians but the Algerian people persisted in their guerrilla war.  This guerilla force later developed into a regular army and the Algerian people won and the French occupation forces were driven out. 

9. Cambodia, Laos, and then Vietnam persisted in their people's war and finally drove out the American invasion forces. Unfortunately, today's Vietnamese authorities have turned back to the path of aggression and of bullying other countries.

10. The people of Zimbabwe and other countries also relied on the people's guerrilla war to defeat colonialism and win their independence and liberation.

All the above ten historical facts prove that no strong aggressive armed force can destroy the patriotic guerrilla armies of the people.  On the contrary, weak patriotic people's guerrilla warfare can eventually drive out the powerful aggressors. The reason why the weak patriotic people's armed forces can defeat the powerful invaders and defend their homeland is that they can win the support of the people, the sympathy and support of the people all over the world.  The invaders, on the other hand, lose their morale over time and become detached from their own people. This is the fundamental reason for their failure.

I would also like to point out that any military man, even those who have led large armies to defeat powerful opponents and who are known as "victorious generals", if he defies the laws of history, he will end up being seen not only as an aggressor politically, but also as a reckless military adventurer.  This does not depend on anyone's will and ability. Of course, the invaded people and the armed forces of the patriotic people will have to struggle hard on a long, tortuous road to achieve victory. Quick victory is impossible. To achieve victory, they must have correct policies. This is how we Chinese communists led the Chinese revolution to victory.

The great forerunner of China's democratic revolution Dr. Sun Yat-sen once made a very good point. He said that in order for the oppressed nations to be liberated, they must "rouse the people" and "unite the peoples of the world who treat us as equals in a common struggle. This refers to both domestic and foreign policies. To "arouse the people" at home means to have the right policy. First, a united front policy, uniting all patriotic classes as much as possible; second, a good economic policy; and third,  focus on building the armed forces, strengthening one's own forces, strict discipline, and a correct policy toward the enemy, including leniency toward prisoners.  As time goes by, they will lose morale and become detached from their own people.

Looking abroad, "uniting all the nations that treat us as equals" means uniting with all the countries and peoples of the world that can be united to support the struggle of our own country. For example, when the resolution on the situation in Cambodia was discussed in the General Assembly this year, 105 countries supported you as compared to 100 last year. China is your good friend, but China is only one country although of course we are one that you can trust.  I hope that you will be able to win the support of the majority of countries and people in the world. I hope, for example, that at least 120 countries out of the 150 countries in the United Nations will support the resolution.  That would be a good thing. If your strength is combined with the strength of the vast majority of the world's countries, and you struggle together, then your victory will be certain. Naturally you will have a hard struggle ahead and you must be tenacious.  The long struggle is painful at times. However, in order to win, you must bear all hardships and sufferings. I am sure that in the end you will be victorious.